Why New Teachers and ESPs Make a Dynamic Team

Transcript

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Demetrius: We all are here for the same reasons. We're all equals. We're all on the same playing field. We're all doing the same thing for our students. We all have that shared common goal. And the reason why we're here is for the students.

Natieka: Hello and welcome to School Me, the National Education Association's podcast dedicated to helping educators thrive at every stage of their careers. I'm your host, Natieka Samuels. In this episode, [00:00:30] we explore the invaluable partnership between education support professionals, or ESPs, and new and aspiring educators in our schools. Our guests, Joie Moore, an ESP from Ohio, and Demetrius Dove, an aspiring educator from Georgia, share their insights and experiences in fostering strong partnerships within the school community.  

Thank you for joining us, Demetrius and Joie. Joie, let's start with you. Can you tell us a little bit about yourself, where you're currently working and what your position is?

Joie: My name is Joie Moore and I'm [00:01:00] an education support professional from Pickerington, Ohio, which is a suburb of Columbus, Ohio. I've been in education for almost 16 years now. What I do in the schools is considered a duty aid, which would fall underneath the paraeducator umbrella in the ESP job categories. And I am president of my local association.

Natieka: Demetrius?

Demetrius: My name is Demetrius Dove. I'm a senior elementary education major at Clark Atlanta University. Currently serve as the state president [00:01:30] for our Georgia Association of Educators Aspiring Educator Program, as well as I serve on the NEEA's board of directors.

Natieka: Joie, can you share with us your journey to education and your role within the Pickerington Education Association?

Joie: So I happenstanced, I guess you could say, into education. I'm actually a national board certified hair colorist. I worked behind the chair as a cosmetologist for about 18 years until I have [00:02:00] a nerve disorder that kept me from doing that. So, I have two kids who are adults now, but when I was diagnosed with my disability, I became through mom within the schools, and I became the number one volunteer. And they said, "Hey, you're here so much, why don't you get paid for doing what you're doing?"  

So that's how I started into my union association and the role within that. Actually, Pickerington Support Staff Association, PSSA is a newer association. We've only been around for about eight [00:02:30] years. When I started within Pickerington schools, I was invited to a unionizing meeting and that started the ball rolling and it took about two years, lots of meetings. And then finally we had the vote at SCRB, which is the State Claimant Relations Board of Ohio, and we passed and we became Pickerington Support Staff Association.  

I started off as a building rep, and then I was invited to a meeting and that meeting led to another meeting, and that meeting led to another [00:03:00] meeting. And then, I am on our district board of directors, it's called Central OEA NEA. And that led to me becoming an Ohio Education Association Board of Directors, and then also president of my Pickerington Support Staff Association. And I'm also a 2023 graduate of the NEA Leadership ESP institute, which was fabulous and I would recommend any ESP to apply for that because it's just amazing the leadership skills you get within [00:03:30] that. And working with the NEAESP quality department

Natieka: And Demetrius, why did you decide to study education?

Demetrius: It's funny. I was actually a business major first when I came to Clark Atlanta University and going through those classes, I was like, "I really don't want to run and crunch numbers all day, sit in a cubicle for the rest of my life." So what could I do to be more active and actually do something that could create positive change? So, I started studying the current landscape of things and I kept seeing education pop [00:04:00] up in the news. I started doing a lot of reading articles and I actually read this book called The Miseducation of the Negro by Dr. Carter G. Woodson. And I just began to start thinking about transitioning into education.  

So, my sophomore year I made the change to education just because I started reflecting on all of those things and reflecting on my own experience that I had not had a black teacher until I came to my college, which is AHBCU. So that's really why I wanted to join is just to become the [00:04:30] representation for students who look like me that I didn't have when I was growing up.

Natieka: And Demetrius, how has your involvement with your union influenced your perspective on this career path after switching majors?

Demetrius: It's really impacted everything because I joined the union maybe two months after I changed my major to education because a professor had told me that GAE was having a day at the capitol, and I was like, "What is GAE?" He was like, "Just come." So I came to the event, I ended [00:05:00] up meeting my Uniserve director and he told me that they were trying to revamp the Aspiring Educators program and that I should run for a position. So I ran for the position, and then just the amount of professional development I've gotten since I've joined, leadership skills, even being in this environment has taught me a lot about public speaking from my state RAs to going to the National Representative Assembly. I've just learned so much and been able to network so much and meet so many people. It's really [00:05:30] affected everything.

Natieka: When people think about who interacts with students in a school, they typically might think of teachers, but ESPs play a really important role as well. So in your thoughts, why are ESPs so important? Not only to the way that a school runs, but also for the students?

Demetrius: I think it's because ESPs are really the first point of contact for students. ESPs are the bus drivers, the school secretaries, our food service workers. [00:06:00] ESPs are the first people that our students see, and also after they would leave my classroom the ESPs continue to support the students further than I would.

Joie: So, I'm a huge ESP advocate, but as Demetrius said, ESPs are the first people that our students see usually on the school day starting with your bus drivers. A lot of our students have meals that are served by our food service workers. When the kids walk into the office, [00:06:30] our secretaries are there. If you need medicine, usually you have your nursing assistants, your health clinic aides that are there to administer sometimes lifesaving medicines like insulin. We get to know the students more so on a personal level than what a lot of the teachers do because we get to spend a little bit more one-on-one time with our students, versus what a teacher has when they have between 20 and 35 students in the classroom, sometimes more depending on your district. A lot of our para-pros are one-to-one, so [00:07:00] they build a relationship with our students, usually starting from kindergarten until they graduate high school.

And then at the end of the day, who's saying bye to them when they're getting onto the buses or walking out of the buildings? It's usually your secretaries, your custodians. Our custodians make sure our buildings are safe and clean and a great work environment for our students and our teachers and all our fellow ESPs. So, we are vital to the running of our education system because imagine one school day when none of your secretaries [00:07:30] were there, none of your para-pros, none of your custodians, the buildings wouldn't open. So in that aspect, ESPs play a vital role to our education system each and every day.

Natieka: I know that you are working on a workshop session about why new or aspiring educators and ESPs make a really good team. And so Demetrius, could you share a memorable experience in your early career [00:08:00] now where an ESP has provided pretty crucial support or guidance during your journey?

Demetrius: Last year, I was in my second practicum experience or field engagement where I was going to a third grade classroom, and this is the first time I was going to be placed at this school. And so I had already received my placement from my university late. And so, I show up to this school and I go into the office, the secretary asks me what I'm here for, and I tell her that [00:08:30] I've been placed here to be in a third grade classroom. And my name is nowhere on the roster, they didn't even know that they were expecting a practicum student.  

And so, I started getting a little stressed or whatever. She was like, "Hold on, just sit down, I got you." And I was like, "Okay.: She stops what she's doing, she gets up, she's going back and forth to the principal's office, she's typing on her computer. In less than 10 minutes, she had went through, found all of the teachers who were eligible for mentoring a student teacher, and [00:09:00] then found the one who was able to accommodate the certain practicum that I was in, because all of our field engagements are centered around a different experience we're supposed to get. And so she directly placed me instead of my university coordinating that, she directly placed me with a teacher. If she didn't do that, I would have probably had to wait maybe weeks to get another placement at a different school, which that could have affected me getting my hours and everything like that. So, that's probably the most [00:09:30] memorable experience because she literally stopped everything that she was doing to place me in a classroom.

Natieka: Joie, do you have a collaboration experience that you remember particularly well with a newer teacher?

Joie: Demetrius and I, we've been talking a lot trying to get our conference session all built up, and I just started thinking about something that I've been working on over the last two years with an early career educator within my building. Our building is the second building that she's been at, and when she came in, she had no fun things for the kids to do with their [00:10:00] downtime, like no games or anything. And my children are now adults, and I was going through all of my toys and board games and blocks, and so on and so forth, and just working with her, building her toy chest, so to say, within her classroom, right there, not only did I impact Mrs. Cooper, but then her 28 students that she had in her classroom. So, when it was rainy outside, they had something to do during indoor recess or when they were done taking their [00:10:30] assessments, they had something to play with.

I have purchased games, Play-Doh, that kind of stuff to help furnish her classroom because, as you all know, educators don't make a lot of money early in our careers, so she doesn't have that extra money to spend on some of that stuff. So, it was nice that I was able to give her gently used items that the kids are just going to play with and enjoy now for years to come. And I go into her classroom and the Legos and the blocks that I've given, the kids are so excited when they get them out of the boxes. That's just one [00:11:00] way that not only was it the early career educator, but then also the students. So it was a way to benefit everybody in that situation.

Natieka: What are some of the strategies that you've found effective in building those stronger relationships between ESPs and teachers within your school? So, maybe even beyond your own personal experience, but just what you've just seen other people be able to do as well.

Joie: I think the biggest thing is communication. Just sitting down and having a conversation with [00:11:30] a fellow educator, a teacher, an ESP, whatever. Because I think that way when you communicate to other educators, to the teachers, you understand what they're going through if they're having any struggles. Sometimes just sitting in the teacher's lounge, you can sit there and just have a quick conversation. Somebody's having a bad day or whatever, and you're just there to either give them support just to listen or maybe offer some advice, especially if they're having something particular with one of the students that you both are aware of. So, I think communication is the big key, and I think [00:12:00] that's from coworkers on up to marriage. I think communication is a huge key to all relationships.

Demetrius: And along those same lines, I would definitely just say making sure that you're building intentional relationships with the people in your building.

Natieka: A lot of what comes up overall about education is pay and working conditions, all of that. And typically we're seeing that teachers are compensated better than ESPs, even though everyone is still fighting for a living [00:12:30] wage. How, if at all, do you feel like the relationships or stronger relationships between educators, even if they're early in their career and ESPs, no matter what stage of their career they're in, how do these relationships maybe foster equity or build power?

Demetrius: Honestly, I really think it's through that the building of relationships through the communication that we can see that, number one, we're all working towards the same common goal. We're all working for the students, but then we can see that if there is, and there is [00:13:00] inequity between let's say pay or anything like that, then we can advocate for each other. We can go to our lawmakers on behalf of our counterparts and we can really make that change.

Joie: I don't know how many teachers I have spoken to and they're like, you guys don't get paid enough for all this stuff that you put up with. And I'm like, you're preaching to the choir. I think it's important because, as an ESP, our jobs are to support our teachers and our students and our community. [00:13:30] That is what ESPs do. And it's nice that when you can get a collaboration with your teachers within either your building, your district and your state, so on and so forth, I think if we could all just come together and get that one unit unified voice, kind of like what we do at a representative assembly through NEA, and we can do that through lobbying within our states, but then also at the national level. So, we're thankful for our NEA directors that do that.

Well, [00:14:00] without the voices of our teachers and our ESPs, that wouldn't happen. So I think it's something that we all need to come together because we're all educators, And it doesn't matter what position you are within the district or in the schools. We all play a vital role, and I think we just need to make sure that we have each other's backs and we advocate for one another. It's what's in the best interest because it's our working conditions, it's our pay, and it's our students, and it's our communities.

Demetrius: Just with what Joie was saying, [00:14:30] I think that advocating for our ESPs will help with that, in the fact that we need to make being an educator, being an education support professional look more attractive. And one of the ways we do that, of course, is by increasing the pay of our ESPs because when we were lobbying in DC at Super Week, one of the things that we would tell our representatives and our senators is that one third of ESPs make $25,000 [00:15:00] or less per year. And one in 10 ESPs are receiving some sort of federal benefits.  

And that should not be. You should be able to work and you should be able to provide for your family, especially when you're going into the school providing and taking care of other people's children, and then you have to go home and you're on SNAP, or some other program like that. You're taking care of other people's children, yet you're struggling to take care of your own. So, I believe that we have to make this [00:15:30] look more attractive so we can fill all of those positions in our schools and we can truly provide at a higher level for the students that we serve.

Natieka: Thanks for listening to School Meet, and a quick thank you to all of the NEA members listening. If you're not an NEA member yet, visit nea.org/whyjoin to learn more about member benefits.

We refer to pretty much all of our members who work in schools as educators, but I know that that's not necessarily how everyone sees it, and maybe not [00:16:00] even how education support professionals might see themselves. Can you both talk a little bit about how ESPs can contribute to promoting social emotional learning or learning essential life skills in school, outside of classrooms perhaps? And I guess now I want to ask how new or aspiring educators can collaborate with ESPs in order to foster that? So it sounds like it's happening naturally, but also how can the collaboration foster [00:16:30] more of that?

Demetrius: I think early career educators maybe could do more of intentionally bringing our ESPs into our classroom spaces, having them speak to our students. I think having them speak to our students on a more intentional basis around some of these issues and having them do some of this life teaching.

Joie: Within the association, I have been so lucky that a lot of my PD has been on social emotional learning. And then I also, the principal [00:17:00] that I work for, she's amazing and she believes in SEL so much. So, it's something that we started off with a crash course and then it's something that I have built on within the last five years. But I think as an ESP and then working with early career educators, and then just any educator in particular, the one thing about ESPs is a lot of times we get to see the kids in their social settings and not in their classroom settings. So yes, we may be a life coach, but we can also talk to their teacher and say, "Hey, I noticed that Billy [00:17:30] is doing this, this, and this. This is not his typical behavior. Maybe if you can watch him in the classroom?"

And I think working collaboratively between all of our educators that we focus on the whole child and their whole wellbeing, their physical, their mental and their social and their academic. Because that's part of being in public education is that we are supposed to build these productive members of society for when they leave us after they graduate high school, and we've got to take in that whole child.  

[00:18:00] The biggest thing that we just need to make sure is that ESPs are a wealth of knowledge for our teachers. I think that is the biggest misconception among teachers about ESPs is that we do play a vital role. And Demetrius and I have had some conversations, he's like, "Oh, I've never thought of it that way." And what an ESP does for a student and for the teachers.  

I think that's the biggest misconception about ESPs. And I'm not going to say our teachers [00:18:30] because it's not all of our teachers. It's a very small number that don't do that. But the general public don't understand what a vital role education support professionals play in our education and our public education school systems throughout our country. And I think that's the biggest thing that we need to get out there.

And I thank Demetrius and the rest of our NEA directors to making sure that when they go to Super Week and they're talking to our senators and our house people that, hey, our ESPs do make a [00:19:00] difference within our students' lives. And I think that's just, I don't want to say a misconception, but maybe something that a lot of people don't think about is that bus driver that gets my kid to school safely every day, somebody who just sits and talks with them when they're having a bad day. I just think it's something that the general public needs to think about too.

Natieka: Demetrius, in your experience, how can education programs better prepare aspiring educators to understand and collaborate [00:19:30] with ESPs more effectively?

Demetrius: Honestly, I think teacher prep programs can really just start teaching about ESPs. I have spoken to my department chair or other people in my department, and I'll say ESPs, and they'll say, "What are you talking about?" And then I have to explain education support professionals and everything that they do. So, I think that we can do a better job of teaching about everyone in the school building and not just teaching. The [00:20:00] pedagogy is great. Teaching about administration is great, but we need to teach our future educators about creating these lasting relationships within the school building that beyond just administration, that's with our education support professionals because a lot of our teacher prep programs are not getting that. And I really didn't learn about ESPs until I got into the union.

Natieka: Speaking of the union, Joie, I wanted to ask if you could talk about the role of the union in [00:20:30] creating these connections and collaborations. Thinking about how initiatives like the ESP educator Voice Academy support ESPs in their professional development, or anything outside of that that you see the union doing?

Joie: In Ohio, we started the Education Support Professional Educator Voice Academy. It was started after there was an education support academy in Ohio for the teachers for a minimum salary for the state of Ohio for our teachers. One of our ESPs directors [00:21:00] at large was like, "Hello, you're missing out on the lowest paid members within your school district," because she was in education for 21 years and they were asking for a minimum salary of $40,000 for our teachers. She's like, "I've been in education for 21 years and I'm just now at that $40,000 threshold." So, what about the ones who actually support our teachers and support our students?  

So, that's where the ESP Voice Academy in Ohio started. So building on that, we came with a new business item at the OEA [00:21:30] Representative Assembly last spring, and it was passed unanimously by the delegate at the OEA RA, and now we have funding to go out and do listening tours, which we are starting. We had a president summit where we got to talk to a lot of the presidents around Ohio. What are some of the issues and some of the things they are dealing with? And ESPs are dealing with a lot of the same issues that our early career educators and our teachers: salary, working conditions and student behaviors.  

And working with our union, [00:22:00] we have different programs in place that we can then bring out to our local associations and say, "Hey, we have this program that will help with this. We have the Bargaining Bootcamp that will help with maybe getting a better cost of living adjustment," that kind of stuff. So the union plays a huge part, but I think the problem is a lot of ESPs are not, we aren't able to get as involved because a lot of our ESPs have two and three jobs. So, I think we also need to make sure that we educate our ESPs [00:22:30] and the ESP local leaders and say, "Hey, we have all these programs to help you from NEA member benefits all the way up to," in Ohio we have the OEA access, which gives us deals and stuff.

So, there's a lot of stuff out there that the union does for ESPs. I think we just need more education on what it is that we can do for our ESPs and our local associations and our leaders.

Natieka: Coming into your career in education in the first couple of years, [00:23:00] there's going to be a lot of things that you're worried about. I think as you come into any new experience. What are some of the things that early career educators probably are concerned about that ESPs can help them with?

Demetrius: I would say that the top three things that we worry about, and I've spoke to a few other aspiring educators and early career educators, would be, number one, acclimating to the school culture, because each school of course is different, [00:23:30] the way it functions and everything like that. The second would be knowing the administration and how they function, because oftentimes administration sets the tone for the school and your experience working in the school. And then the last one would just be overall preparedness. A lot of us coming out of teacher prep programs and going into the first year of teaching, we just feel like we weren't adequately prepared for the job and the real life implications [00:24:00] of the job overall preparedness.

Natieka: And Joie, how do you feel that ESPs in various roles can assist with that?

Joie: My household's a little different. I've been married to my husband now for almost 24 years, and he is a, we'll say a seasoned educator. He's been a teacher for 27-and-a-half years. And the one thing he always told me before I got into education was, "The two most important people in your building is going to be your head secretary and your head custodian because they're the ones who rule your school. So if you need to know anything, those are the two people that you go to."

And [00:24:30] I think that's something that we need to share with our early career educators is knowing who they need to go to for the preparedness. Because if something happens to a copier, who do you go to? If your lights aren't working, who do you go to? If you just need, I don't know, a little piece of advice, who do you go to?

And I think because a lot of ESPs have been within the education system for a lot longer than a lot of our teachers, I think we need to work with our local associations and not do a mentorship, but maybe having [00:25:00] one of your veterans or your seasoned ESPs within your school help those early career educators and say, "Hey, well, we have a sunshine fund to do this. If you see your administrator walking in this, this is when you want to stay away. But if they're walking like this, this is when it's a great time to approach them." Because a lot of us have worked in our districts for so long that we know the moods and stuff of our educators, so helping with that, Demetrius, I think that would be a great start acclimating to school culture. I think just saying hi and being [00:25:30] helpful because we're all families within our schools and we all know that because we couldn't do anything without each other.  

And then preparedness, working with our ECEs is going to be just, "Hey, how can I help support you?" Because that's what ESPs do is that we support our teachers and our students, and so we're there just to help anybody within our schools for anything that we can do. And that's the true heart of an ESP.

Natieka: Joie, could you share an example of a larger collaborative project or initiative between ESPs and teachers that had a positive effect on [00:26:00] the school community and students in particular?

Joie: In our district, our teachers, they were advocating for students, and I just remember that there was a call to action that came out from our education association, and so I put it out to our support staff association. And granted, we didn't have the huge numbers that I would hope the ESPs would have shown up. But like I said, a lot of our ESPs work second jobs, so I know a lot of people couldn't be there. Plus ESPs also work all three shifts, We have first, second, and third [00:26:30] shifters too, but we did have quite a few come out and support our teachers. So then in turn supported our students holding up signs, they brought kids saying, "I value my teachers," and that kind of stuff. So I think being there that way.  

Another way within our union and our association within our district is having our district at Central OEANEA president is a teacher actually in my district, and she knows the importance of ESP. So, we brought back [00:27:00] the ESP committee and working on having our voices louder within our district association because she knows the importance of our ESPs and vice versa.

But I think we also need to work together as our EAs and our ESPs, SSAs, support staff associations, whatever they are within your local, I think we need to start working together more to be collaborative, so then that way our issues are the teacher's issues. Our work sites, working conditions, [00:27:30] our students, and our pay. It's something that affects us all, and I think if we can all come together and have that larger voice, then advocating for our teachers and then our teachers advocating for our ESPs is just going to make it that much better because you're going to have that many voices behind you. I think it's just all being collaborative and working together because we all want the best for our students in our schools, but coming together and not butting heads I think is a big part of that.

Natieka: What advice would you give to, in [00:28:00] your case, Demetrius, your fellow newer or aspiring educators who are really interested in this idea of fostering relationships, not just with their fellow teachers, but with ESPs? How do you suggest that they start maybe day one, maybe week one with effective partnerships, creating positive outcomes for themselves and making their own way around? And also helping the students get the most out of their day?

Demetrius: Number one, I would just say remembering that we all have [00:28:30] that shared common goal and the reason why we're here is for the students. And then I would say just to make sure that we are not looking down on anyone, or anything like that, in the school building because we all are here for the same reasons. We're all equals, we're all on the same playing field. We're all doing the same thing for our students. We're all fighting for our students.  

And then just again, to make sure that we are being intentional. That's one of my big things for [00:29:00] the year, is just being intentional in everything. So, just making sure that we're intentionally building these relationships, not just building the relationship because you want somebody to always run to when something is broken in your classroom. Making sure you're actually caring for people, making sure you actually have their best interest in mind, and making sure that you actually are wanting to collaborate for our students.

Joie: Just starting out, I think when you first walk [00:29:30] into a school building on your first day with students, it's always very nerve wracking. And I think the biggest thing is, as a veteran ESP, I've been there. I know that feeling. And I think our early career educators need to realize that we've all been in their shoes at one point or another. And I think our veteran educators need to remember that and be there to help our ECEs. And then that way, just saying hello and being intentional in building those relationships because [00:30:00] we're all working together for the same goal at the end of the day.  

And I think that's something that we all need to remember. It doesn't matter if you're an ESP or a teacher, we're all there for the same reason. And I love Demetrius' word, being intentional about building those relationships and knowing that we've all been there, we've all been there that first day of school, looking at a classroom full of students and being like, "Oh my gosh, what did I do? What did I get myself into? But it's something that we all love or else we wouldn't be here."

[00:30:30] And I think that's something else that we need to think about. And it doesn't matter if you're a zero year or year 30th year, we've all been there. We know what it's like and we do need to build those relationships. And we need to be there for our fellow educators and build them up so they can get to year 30, especially at a time when there's not enough people to fill the positions that we have within our schools. I think we need to make sure that we're there and we are helping each other and loving on each other to make sure that we are [00:31:00] all doing a great job for our students.

Natieka: Okay, so time for the last question. What are you looking forward to right now?

Demetrius: Honestly, I am looking forward to graduation. I will be graduating in December of 2024, and I'm looking forward to starting my career and looking forward to continuing my union journey and my leadership journey as well.

Joie: Mine is going to be a little bit of everything. I'm excited to work with Demetrius on bringing this amazing [00:31:30] collaboration experience to our ESPs at the NEAESP conference. And then I'm also excited about NEA leadership, which I will be attending. And then I'm looking forward to spring break. It's been a long, January was a long year with our students. I would say a month, but it felt more like a year. And I'm looking forward to then coming back refreshed after spring break and finish out the school year strong with all of our students. That's what I'm looking forward to is this [00:32:00] is the time for our conferences at the state level and our national level, and they always fill me up and get me ready to go back into the classroom and to help my students. And then having that little break and then coming back and finishing the school year strong, because when we get our cups filled at these conferences, then we're there to be able to fill the cups of our teachers and our students and finish the year strong.

Natieka: Great. Well, thank you so much to both of you for sitting down with us today and giving us all [00:32:30] this great advice.

Joie: Thank you so much.

Demetrius: Thank you.

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